National Electrical Installation Standards

NEC 2017 Article 210.8 (A)(7) Interpretation, Charlie- Dwelling Unit Questions: 1). We have a wall hung microwave located directly above a sink where the distance between countertop and bottom of microwave is 18”, and the receptacle for the microwave is located in the cabinet above. Does this receptacle require GFCI protection if the microwave cord passes through a fixed barrier? 2). Do the receptacles for the garbage disposal, dishwasher, and beverage cooler below the countertop require GFCI protection? Joe Koss
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Good Morning, We are currently wiring several new Hospitals that were permitted in 2016 when the 2014 NEC was in effect. Because these buildings are taller than 75 feet we have made sure to have the feeders for the life safety panels protected by either sprinklers or 2hr rated chase, But in some areas this was not feasible so we elected to run 2hr fire rated Draka cable to those Panels. I recently noticed in 6.4.2.2.1.6(B) 2015 NFPA 99 that fire protection of emergency feeders in 700.10(D)1-3 does not apply to Hospitals. Which code overrules which, 2014 NFPA 70 or 2015 NFPA 99? Secondly, we are starting another Hospital where the 2017 NFPA 70 & 2015 NFPA 99 are in effect. In the 2017 NEC It specifically states that Healthcare Facilities where persons are not capable of self-preservation are to have the fire Protection of Life Safety feeders. Which is still in direct conflict with the 2015 NFPA 99. Which code prevails? Thanks, Kelly Wofford
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I am roughing in mc horizontally but my box is mounted vertically within a foot of a stud hole that I'm running through. Does that stud count as a support or do I still need one? Matt Stephens
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Are electrical panels required to be locked? Brian Lord
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Can a pendant style (hanging) LED light fixture with a hard wired pigtail (277v) cord be hardwired to a Junction box? They do not move, but they are not rigid and they are up 10' above the work area. Eric Harrington
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I have a lug that has a 1/2 hole on a load side of a breaker...can I use a 3/8 bolt? Jerry Marquez
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Re: CQD answer published Thursday, April 26, 2018 -Field Labeling Charlie, in the answer you gave to the CQD for April 26 you mentioned field labeling. What is that? Thank You, Kaylea
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Emerg. Shunt Trips, Service Entrance Shunt trip. What is the Max. height it can be installed? Bill Sweney
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How can a electrical inspector overlook a service that is not equipped to handle the everyday load of a home based on the age of the house? Jeff Sloat
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Re: CQD answer published Friday, April 20, 2018 -LFMC Support 1) There is Building codes in NY as such as 300.11 nec that offer some direction. Bill 2) Wire wraps are not "Listed" products, they normally are only "Recognized" products, which are in the UL "Yellow" books. Their use for electrical applications is limited to where they are used in a controlled situation such as a manufacturer of Industrial Control Panels. Sometimes their permitted inside panel boxes to aid in wire "marshaling" or "management" of individual conductors. They are even not "Listed" for use with communication equipment wiring such as PLTC. Use of wire wraps for any field wiring purpose per NEC would be a violation of 110.3(b) per the LFNMC manufacturer's instructions. There are no "Listed" means that I know of that facilitate attachment of LFNMC to any sort of service, including fuel gas, piping means. As a general rule, electrical raceways, equipment, enclosures, etc., are required to be mechanically supported on structural supports independent of other services or special structures such as guard rails, stairway structures. Best Regards, Nick Abbatiello 3) In Reference to Bills question LMFC supported by tie wraps to gas piping. As an inspector myself I have on many occasions found raceways supported that way and always have required it to be corrected. My corrections cite the listing of the products involved. Tie wraps are listed for support of cable assemblies and are not listed for the support of raceways. In short if you are installing a raceway assembly you must use an approved raceway support method, and cable ties/ tie-wraps are not an approved method. But see the new change to 350.30 (A) allowing this type of installation provided the cable ties are properly listed. Randy Hess 4) Regarding the support of sealtite from the generator by tie-wrapping it to the gas pipe. This along with using the same means to connect the AC sealtite to the coolant line is a common and accepted practice in our jurisdiction. Bill you must be one of those inspectors that make your own rules up as you go along. Pretty picky! George Koetters-Retired 5) In regards to wire tying carflex to a flexible natural gas line, I too would discourage this practice, although neat and workmanlike, the flexible appliance gas line may not absorb the settling or movement. If a rigiddly connected and properly support rigid gas line, I'd ok that if it serves the same connected standby generation unit ( similar to securing the protected thermostat line on a HVAC unit to the raceway used to provide power to the HVAC unit). Still your call as to suitability in your area of jurisdiction. REM 6) If I understand the question right, the installer is trying to run LFNC, FlexLine, CarFlex or some such material from the home to the generator. NFPA 70, NEC 2017 Article 356 Type LFNC 356.12 Uses Not Permitted (1) Where subject to physical damage.No matter how this was run, it would be subject to physical damage. Underground, emerging from grade may or may not be subject to repeated hits from a lawn mower or lawn tractor but here in NH it could be subject to repeated hits from a snow blower (almost every application, a path is done to a generator) and I would insist on Sch 80 PVC, intermediate or hard conduit. Then there is the manufactures FAQ sheets, this material is not allowed where there are extreme temperature swings (We had three days in February 50, 60 & 70 degrees during the day and 10 degrees at night). One manufacture will not even give a low temperature and states it becomes very brittle in cold temps. When I first saw this trying to be used some six years ago, I called the manufacture and was told it would not even stand up to a weed whacker (that and a propane line - I do not want to be that guy in the news [and the goal is safety]). At any rate, that is my take on it (Physical damage Up to the AHJ). We have had only a couple electricians try to use this. A loop above 18" for vibration purposes would seem the best use for this but here the temperature range is an issue...Thanks for this forum, miss Charlie but you do a great job with this. Thanks again, Bob 7) Hello Charlie and readers. The concept of using another trades to support electrical wiring... It seems like it would be common practice for electricians to use other trades work to support and secure wiring; framing being one of them. Masonry being another. I can see why the original question is being proposed that does not seem like a safe practice. Charlie I'm wondering if maybe this could be answered by you, are conduits allowed to be supported by other continents or piping. I have seen another practice by solar installers where Unistrut is used and pounded into the ground and then used to support EMT or other types of conduit like rigid.. would either of these means be approved for installation by the NEC I understand that the ahj may or may not have its own opinion in this matter.. your thoughts comments and professional opinion are highly regarded! Thanks, Oliver Allen
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Hello Charlie, long time reader here. My name is Steve, I'm a Vermont electrician with a question about meter enclosures I'm hoping you can help me with. It would appear there is a dispute in just what the 1/4" knockouts on the bottom of your meters are really for. Some say it's for the GEC (Grounding Electrode conductor), usually a bare #6 or #4 copper wire to simply run through. Others claim a 'Kenny Clamp' or other sort of listed connector is to be used. What is to code?....are the NEC passage(s) below being applicable Thank you for your time, Steve Vermont Electrician
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I have a project that I am currently working on that requires the replacement of 15 KVA primary transformers. Upon research of the existing transformers and branch I ran across a transformer that feeds a bank of disconnect switches. The secondary side of the disconnect switches then feed back into the secondary section of the transformer and out to their specified load in underground conduit. “see attached email with pictures of existing and notes from plans” Can the secondary section of the transformer be used as a wireway? Thank You, Roger Schmidt
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Hello Charlie. Many people may not know you have left us but your legacy still lives on. I recently installed individual circuits for gas burners in a two family & four family dwelling’s basements. I could not find in the NEC where it says disconnects are required by the top of stairs(on the unit of course). I was always under the assumption it was required? Your thoughts please Thank you, Ed LoGatto
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Per NEC 690.12(2). If the PV module is rated at above 30 V and rated at 350 Watts, will it still be required to have "rapid shutdown" even though the distance of the inverter (which has disconnecting means) is less than 10 ft from the array to comply per NEC 690.12(2)? The PV system is on the roof? Jessie Santos
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For a system can be supplied either strictly from a utility source or strictly from a generator, the 2014 NEC code specifically addresses where to ground the generator neutral based on using either a 3 pole transfer switch or a 4 pole transfer switch. However, each of these scenarios appear to assume that there are neutral loads and therefore, a neutral will be ran from both the utility service entrance equipment to the transfer switch and from the generator to the transfer switch. If a 3 pole transfer switch is used, the generator neutral is not grounded at the generator but is ran to the transfer switch where it is solidly connected to the neutral from the utility service entrance equipment (i.e a non-separately derived system). If a 4 pole transfer switch is used, the generator neutral is grounded at the generator and both the generator neutral and the utility service neutral are connected to the 4th pole of the transfer switch where they are switched (i.e. a separately derived system). However, where in the code does it address what to do when there are no neutral loads and therefore, there is no need for the utility neutral to continue beyond the service entrance equipment or for the generator neutral to extend beyond the generator? The code seems to imply that there must be a neutral wire between the generator and the utility service entrance equipment, but I can't find where it specifically states this. If you have a 4 pole transfer switch and you ground the generator neutral at the generator, this appears to be the definition of a separately derived system. However, in this situation, if you do not run a neutral from the utility service to the 4 pole transfer switch or from the generator to the 4 pole transfer switch, is this a code violation? If this is not a code violation, would it become a code violation if you replaced the 4 pole transfer switch with a 3 pole transfer switch under this situation (i.e. no neutral loads - therefore, no neutral from the generator or the utility service entrance equipment)? In each of these situations, please assume ground fault protection/indication has been addressed when operating solely off the utility and solely off generator. Thanks, Chris D.
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